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Meme time!

I've decided to steal the meme from shivver13. I've never done something like that before, but apparently it works like this: name a character and I'll answer the following questions:

  • Why I like them:

  • Why I don't:

  • Favourite Season:

  • Favorite episode:

  • Favourite Line:

  • OTP:

  • Brotp:

  • Unpopular opinion:

  • A wish:

  • An oh-god-please-dont-ever-happen:

It can be a character from Doctor Who, Sherlock, Broadchurch, Jessica Jones or any tv series you know I am or was a fan of, or even - what the hell - a series of books or movies (I'll replace "episode" with "book" or something :)). So, anyone wants to play?

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( 16 comments — Leave a comment )
aletheiafelinea
Jan. 30th, 2017 06:44 pm (UTC)
Jessica Jones, the character, I mean. :)
alumfelga
Feb. 3rd, 2017 10:08 pm (UTC)
Jessica Jones it is!

Why I like them: She went through hell with Kilgrave, and yet, when he comes back, she doesn't give up to her initial reaction of running away, but decides to fight him. Is it more because she wants to save another girl from him or because she can't recover if she always runs, we don't know for sure, I think it's both. That makes Jessica a person from the real life, a believable hero, not a character that is simply "good" so he "fights evil".

Why I don't: If your neighbours are too loud, do you really have to show your strength and threaten them? In everyday situations, she could lower her "badass" attitude a bit.

Favourite Season: There's only been one for now :) But I'm going to give season 2 a go and see Jessica finally recovering from the trauma.

Favorite episode: Episode 8. When they "play heroes" and save the family, Kilgrave tries to manipulate Jessica into the "you're the only one who can save me" trope, and we see her struggle with the idea. I was really worried she'd believe she had a moral duty to try to fix him and make him use his powers to do good. It's what heroes often do, even if they have to give up their freedom. But Jessica decides it's not what she wants to do, and comes back to her plan of making Kilgrave go to jail.

Favourite Line: Every time she stands for herself and doesn't let Kilgrave manipulate the truth. And this one: Kilgrave? Talk about obvious. Was 'murdercorpse' already taken?

OTP: I think it would be good for her if she stayed single for some time so she can prove there are other story arcs for female characters than love, too.

Brotp: Jessica and Malcolm. He's that trustworthy friend she needs, and he believes people are generally good so he needs someone to protect him.

Unpopular opinion: I think the series might have been better without Luke Cage.

A wish: I'd like to see how Jessica rebuilds her life and learns her way to the society again. Is she going to help people now? Does she care? Does the fact that she killed a man with cold blood haunt her?

An oh-god-please-dont-ever-happen: Writers, don't try to create a bigger and more evil villain than Kilgrave. No one can compete with him. Just try to think of a new story that lets Jessica develop as a character.
shyfoxling
Feb. 3rd, 2017 10:41 pm (UTC)
Pedantic opinion: The "Kilgrave" joke doesn't work for me because "kil" is a legitimate initial element meaning "chapel, churchyard" in some Irish and Scottish names, like Kilpatrick and Kildare. So it just comes off like she's picking the wrong way to make fun of a perfectly normal name.
alumfelga
Feb. 4th, 2017 11:55 am (UTC)
I consider it a meta-joke. In the comic book, his name is written "Killgrave" and he's supposed to be Croatian(!). Surely the comic book's authors just wanted his name to sound sinister and used English words. This is what I believe Jessica and the series' writers mock.

Thanks for letting me know about the "kil" part. In the series, Kilgrave is English s0 his made up name actually makes sense!
aletheiafelinea
Feb. 4th, 2017 03:02 pm (UTC)
not a character that is simply "good" so he "fights evil".
Ah, yes. This usually sells it to me as well. Or rather the simple good vs. evil trope doesn't sell it to me.

see Jessica finally recovering from the trauma.
Not sure if you can expect it if they want a third, too. ;D

I was really worried she'd believe she had a moral duty ... But Jessica decides it's not what she wants to do
Good.

so she can prove there are other story arcs for female characters than love, too.
For me it's even more "that not every plot needs a love story arc", female involving or not.

don't try to create a bigger and more evil villain
So true for most series...
alumfelga
Feb. 5th, 2017 04:18 pm (UTC)
Or rather the simple good vs. evil trope doesn't sell it to me.
There's another great moment in Jessica Jones. Before she meets Kilgrave, she gives the hero idea a go and tries to "fight evil". Kilgave sees her strength when she fights some thieves on the street and this is how they meet. If she didn't use her powers, she'd be safe.

Not sure if you can expect it if they want a third, too.
I don't want Kilgrave to dominate her whole story. She's better than that and the writers are better than that. There are other places they can take her to.

For me it's even more "that not every plot needs a love story arc", female involving or not.
I agree. With female characters, it just happens a bit more often.
aletheiafelinea
Feb. 5th, 2017 10:50 pm (UTC)
If she didn't use her powers, she'd be safe.
Neat. I don't necessarily read it as "May it be thy lesson", but rather "Your choice, but remember everything you do (or not do) has consequences". Though one can't predict exactly what consequences, especially in long term.

She's better than that and the writers are better than that. There are other places they can take her to.
I feel you... Maybe my main problem with this genre is that it's always so... maximal in scale. Everything must be super, especially villains, and it's always the world that needs to be saved, nothing less. But that makes the plots very rough-sketched, broad but shallow, like puddles. That's certainly one of reasons I like fics better than canon for, in this genre. They focus on something smaller, but in depth. Though TV Marvel is already less whole-wordly than big movies, if I'm not mistaken?
alumfelga
Feb. 6th, 2017 12:21 pm (UTC)
I don't necessarily read it as "May it be thy lesson", but rather "Your choice, but remember everything you do (or not do) has consequences".
I agree, and the writers definitely don't want us to think Jessica shouldn't be a hero, they just show us how naive she initially was. She was happy to save a passing by man from being beaten but immediately, she got herself in a situation she wasn't able to get out from (she escaped after a year, only by luck). And when she meets Kilgrave for the second time, she doesn't use her superstrength often - it's all about planning, thinking, getting help from others and tough decisions. This is when she becomes a hero, not when she just walks at nights to see if she can hit someone "bad".

Though TV Marvel is already less whole-wordly than big movies, if I'm not mistaken?
The only tv Marvel I've seen is Jessica Jones, so I can only talk about it. Here, the whole world isn't in danger. Kilgrave has no intention of ruling the world, he just wants to live a comfortable life, with everyone fulfilling his every whim. He needs a car, he goes into one and says where he wants the driver to drive him. He likes a girl, he makes her wear, say and do what he likes. That sort of things. When Jessica fights him, she fights for her own freedom (Kilgrave wouldn't leave her alone) and few other people's he's enslaved at the moment, so she doesn't fight for "everyone", but "anyone", since anyone could be his victim. I can't say enough how much I liked it, since big danger doesn't always feel real. It certainly didn't in Doctor Strange :)
aletheiafelinea
Feb. 6th, 2017 03:05 pm (UTC)
Here, the whole world isn't in danger. Kilgrave has no intention of ruling the world ... doesn't fight for "everyone", but "anyone", since anyone could be his victim. ... big danger doesn't always feel real.
You're making me consider actually watching it, though I'm not promising anything...
alumfelga
Feb. 11th, 2017 06:09 pm (UTC)
*fingers crossed*
My work is done here, then ;)
shivver13
Feb. 4th, 2017 01:55 am (UTC)
This isn't the character I had in mind earlier and I will return if I can remember who it was, but for now, Captain Jack Harkness.
alumfelga
Feb. 5th, 2017 03:53 pm (UTC)
Feel free to return with another character. For now, let's discuss captain Jack!

Why I like them: His story's the perfect lesson of acceptance. I like how the Doctor suggests he's somehow "wrong" and it seems valid - it's often said in Doctor Who that no one can live forever - but then he accepts him despite his "gut feeling" and we learn Jack doesn't violate the whoniverse's rules after all and dies as the Face of Boe. It shows us even the Doctor can be wrong and prejudiced and we shouldn't give up to our initial "gut feelings". I think it corresponds well with Jack's sexuality, as prejudice against non-heterosexual people is a huge issue in our society.
I also like how Jack makes people around him feel - good. He's never intrusive or offensive with flirting, never lies about his intentions and you can be sure you're only going to do what you want to do. In the world where sex still comes with danger and words "he flirts with everyone" don't sound positive, Jack is an example of a person who's confident and direct about sex, but also respectful and charming.

Why I don't: There's a difference between Jack in Doctor Who and Jack in Torchwood. I can't deny I like the first Jack more and ignore some Jack's actions that I felt were stepping over a line. Ordering Ianto to kil Lisa was almost unforgivable.

Favourite Season: Frankly, I don't remember Torchwood as well as I know Doctor Who, but for Jack's development, I think the best seanon was season 2. I haven't seen the fourth one though.

Favorite episode: Doctor Who season 3 finales. From episode 11 to 13, he learns about himself, helps the Doctor and undresses because he looks good. He's never better.

Favourite Line: You people and your quaint little categories.

OTP: I don't think I have one. I don't mind Jack/Ianto, athough I'm not a shipper either.

Brotp: Jack/Ten. I believe they met more times, and often sat in silence, knowing what the other person felt, understanding each other's loneliness.

Unpopular opinion: This is probably going to sound shallow, but... I really expected more adult scenes between Jack and whoever the writers decide to pair him with. If sex is so natural for him, why is there only one hot scene between him and Ianto in two seasons? I don't know if it's unpopular, but I didn't see anyone else complaining about it.

A wish: A fanfiction: Jackie is angry with the Doctor (he needs something from her and she refuses?) and Jack shows up, charming as always. She gives him a hard time ("I know men like you") but even she can't resist captain Jack Harkness. Finally she agrees as Jack promises her something. For some reason, since then she stops slapping the Doctor.

An oh-god-please-dont-ever-happen: Don't make mistake of missing Jack in the next anniversary episode. He deserves at least a cameo.
shivver13
Feb. 6th, 2017 01:11 am (UTC)
Oh, I love the observation that Jack's story is all about acceptance. I never really looked at it that way, but yes, I agree with that. I don't really agree with the Doctor's original reaction to him was a prejudice, though. In my mind, because Jack is an anomaly, he tweaks the Doctor's time sense and it's uncomfortable for him to look at Jack. I liken it to how it is that some people have a voice that bothers you in some way, and even though they may become a good friend, that discomfort from hearing their voice never goes away. However, your point does still stand, that it shows that the Doctor may initially reject someone because of something like that, but then comes around and is willing to live with the discomfort for the sake of his friend.

I also like the portrayal of Jack's complete comfort with his sexuality and that, as you said, he is respectful of others.

Jack in Torchwood was... incomprehensible at times. He was portrayed in DW as someone fiercely protective of his Torchwood team, but in TW, he was often callous and secretive about things they needed to know. I never really felt that the team were at all cohesive and a lot of that has to do with the way that Jack kept them at arm's length. (And I never really saw any chemistry between Jack and Ianto. Suddenly they were sleeping together, and that was about all we saw about them until Ianto was talking about him to his sister in Children of Earth.)

alumfelga
Feb. 10th, 2017 10:20 pm (UTC)
I guess Jack-bothering-the Doctor can be described in various ways. I know what you mean with the voice that bothers you, and maybe that's exactly what the Doctor feels. My point is, the Doctor (or any Time Lord) doesn't have a right to decide if Jack is "wrong" so if he feels wrong to him, it's still the Doctor who has a problem. Maybe "prejudice" isn't the best word... Anyway, the most important thing is, as you say, that he accepts him as he is and even asks him if he wanted to join the TARDIS.

I understand why Jack didn't tell his team about the Doctor, Torchwood's number one enemy, but if I remember correctly, he was mysterious about his immortality and that's important fact.
shivver13
Feb. 6th, 2017 01:12 am (UTC)
So, again, this isn't the character I was thinking about before, but my husband and I were talking about her yesterday and I was wondering what you thought about Madame Vastra?
alumfelga
Feb. 12th, 2017 08:53 pm (UTC)
I needed so much time to answer because I don't watch episodes with her very often and I needed a quick reminder. I'm afraid it's one big rant.

Why I like them: Well, the general idea is nice: in Doctor Who world, it's good to have some aliens as reccuring characters, the Doctor's friends. I enjoyed the two parter with the Silurians, I'm aware of their long history in Doctor Who, so they're a good race for that. You could remind the viewers from time to time that the conflict between humans and Silurians still isn't resolved.

Why I don't: Oh, where should I start. The thing I said above doesn't happen - other Silurians are never mentioned. She comes out of nowhere (I seriously thought I missed an episode when I saw her for the first time. We don't have to know the whole story, but every new character needs exposition and I feel like Vastra lacks one, she just appears as the Doctor's "old friend"). She becomes an expert on Eleven in "Snowmen" and an expert on regeneration in "Deep Breath" (while Clara has already seen multiple versions of the Doctor! I hate their argument there. The Doctor's face is not a veil and why wouldn't Clara fall for Eleven? It's okay). She's really mean to Jenny and for the most of the time, I don't see they love each other. She's supposed to add to representation, but as Moffat can only write one heterosexual couple, he probably can write only one homosexual couple, too - the dynamic between Vastra and Jenny is the same as between the lesbian couple in "Jekyll". We're said she's clever, but we hardly see it (and the one word rule was quite stupid). We don't really see much of her, for most of the time she either fights, talks about apes and men or teaches Clara a lesson. She doesn't have her own story. She only has features all Moffat female characters have. So, TL;DR: I think she's terribly written.

Favourite Season: Not choosing.

Favorite episode: I don't like any of her episodes much, but I think she's best in "Name of the Doctor", because it's the only time we see her having any emotions - when she loses Jenny and kills Strax in self-defence. We see she really cared about them.

Favourite Line: It's surprising how little significant things she says. I don't agree with most of things she says in "Deep breath", so I'm going to quote that little dialogue I found:
Strax: The heart is a relatively simple thing.
Vastra: I have not found it to be so.

If we only had more scenes like that.

OTP: I'm okay with Jenny and Vastra, but let us see how they are, let them have an argument, let us know what they think about each other and why they are together.

Brotp: Someone new. We only saw her with few people, talking about the Doctor. Her, in the TARDIS for a couple of episodes, with the Doctor and Bill? Learning some respect for other races?

Unpopular opinion: I don't really get why she lives in Victorian London. She'd be much happier and also could do more in a more tolerant world in the future, but no one else seems to think that.

A wish: I'd like to see her being actually important in an episode. Without Strax and Jenny, just her, seeing something new, learning something new, or at least we learn something new about her. She seems a wasted character to me.

An oh-god-please-dont-ever-happen: Not another Vastra-Jenny-Strax episode, please. When they're together, they're only a comic relief, not funny at all.
( 16 comments — Leave a comment )